thought id open a new thread for us to show off all the good stuff were building and making a place to share ideas and show off our work..it seems were in a good ere as far as making stuff and not relying on the manufacturer...true kiwi style. some of are quite advanced at this, you know who you are...and your an inspiration for people like me who are starting to dabbel...
anyway, ill start...
this is rexton in my shed making some re-enforcment for his seat as the weight of the landings on the tubes was bending them...its not pretty yet but its not ganna bend at that point again..

this is the best shot of the new seat supports, they were bending quite badly so we added a bit xtra.....
time will tell..
got a long way to go before we make a buggy

Cool! I've also long since braced the bottom of the triangle by welding in some brackets and bolting a little strut in place each side. Gave the bigfoot another few years but it will need a makeover in a year.

Lazy? After fixing the roof, mowing the lawns and some gardening I still managed to complete the Moosetruck back axle. Just short on some material after doing some work for someone else... isn't that always the case. Else I'd have make work of the fork too. I need to be stocking up on offcuts again!

One more 'red' to pull off the hub. This one caught me out. It had an inner tube and the valve pulled back so now I'm struggling to deflate the tube and I can't push the tyre low enough to pull the bead over. Made a very nice rim protector for barrows though.

Otherwise I've registered a blog site last week. Just waiting to take some photos before linking it out. Rain caught me out again. Tell Plummet to leave the weather to the professionals.

Woohoo.

awesome guys , next stop, you will be designing and builting new buggyies
as that idea is all ready in your head, but which idea do you do first

thats some manly welding going on.

one thing i don't understand with buggies is that theres bugger all triangulation going on. its a basic engineering principle. if you need a stiff strong frame slap in some triangles! i'm obviously missing something...

nope, not missing anything, i dont know why....i did mention it, we have some rebar ready to do just that job...its the first thing im gonna do when my buggy starts bending...i dont know why all buggies arnt made that way.

Which ideas? Well firstly the ones I have materials or money for. Either that or start the next one while I wait for more materials because I changed my mind on the former idea! In the end I'm working on all of them in various stages and even forget about some till I find it on the back of the workbench a few months later!

Please don't user rebar... it is fugly and not proper steel though you'll likely discover it welds like rubbish by now. Even mild steel roundbar and tube is better and very cheap. If you stuck for some let me know. Heck even get some 1" flat bar and make it pretty.... anything but rebar!

On bracing: it's a balance of minimalism and legacy. Why have buggy's not evolved much over a decade? On one hand it takes a lot to improve the basic concept on the other the original concept was never meant to be jumped or deal with the stresses needed at 100kph. It's not in the manufacturer's best interst to build a buggy that lasts and people building their own tend to copy what's out there. Only after a few years of building your own do you break the mold and build something different. In the mean time 100's of PL and Flexifoil classics are still being sold to people intending to do no more than baf around on the vacant soccer field. What I find entertaining as that of all the kiting products only kitebuggies are expected to outlast their abuse!

hehe i am never one to stick to tried and true practice!!
why build something thats already been built before? build something beter!
yes i too would use tube as apposed to rebar or flat bar or any bar for that matter...

another thing i don't get is the foot pegs. why on earth use slippery tube for foot pegs>? if i built a buggy i'd use a platform type mountain bike pedal or moto foot peg. Hell you could even use mtb spd's if you didn't want your foot to come off.
Nuts!

Al is that an intense uzzi frame i see lurking in the background?.... nice.

Guster do you have any 80 duro urethane resin i can buy small quantities of?
I want to try 80 duro (or harder) in my truck but don't need or want to pay for a gallon of 80 duro resin..... i need like 100mm max.. and that will do 4 sets of bushings.

Flat bar is easier to weld onto a tube otherwise when using tube there's a bit of fit-up needed to join tube to tube. Quick work with an angle grinder and handfile but fishmouthing's not everyones cuppa tea.

Think you'll find many customs don't use round pegs and the ones that do have some grippy stuff on them. It's only uncomfortable when not wearing shoes and I guess Flexi and PL is just making good use of hos short lengths of offcuts. :O)Flat surface can also be rough if you don't get the angle right.

Anyway.. quit dissing our rides bro! I think we have a closet buggier on our hands people.

I've only got 60 duro and now 5 pairs of elastomers to cast I may have to buy more before I get to 4 of those. You making another board?

so i start a new thread an then answer the questions in the other threads CLEVER.
thats an uzzi alright, but its dead, iv never ridden it.
head tube and bb shell are ovalised...its just artwork now, did you have one??

you can tell hese thinking about it eh guster, gettin all involved in out footpegs an whatnot
you cant blame him tho....know your enemy an all that

i cant wait for the day when i own a mig and have the money for stock, right now its just dirty stick and make it up as you go work, the real builds are probably a year away...
you guys are like engineering gods right now, in a cant wait to get involved.

truck housing getting vac bagged.

carbon glass landboard deck being vac bagged.

home made vac bag pump set up.
fridge pump, lpg bottle as accumulator...

and don't you worry i see the glory or buggying and kite surfing.... but time only allows me to do one and boarding is the most convenient and least time consuming setup wise so it wins.

if i tried to kitesurf and buggy i'd end up doing all badly.

hehe , they are all related, but the board is the easiest to setup and second easiest to trasport, I know the benefits, but i took my fully rigged buggy last week to the beach and drove home with it fully rigged too so im on a par with you time wise with that bit of eqiupment, and my 4 liner is prerigged and rolled so thats faster too. p.s. you lot im going back to 20m lines for the 6m kite to get a faster " pop" out of it, lets face it a 6m kite is not ever going to be the fastest kite in the world so getting up to my usual 60kmph faster is a better bet . I love the red axle Guys, love the mould Plumtree, need some shots of the moose truck Guster and carbon forks gannet. The extra steel would be better under the frame AL, its stronger in tension , but it still looks like its there to stay !! Young padawan Al, Im happy to show you all my notes on the buggies i have made so you can begin where i am now and make something even better , i am sure you and Rex have some great ideas to throw into your own unique buggies

Nah just experience and a little inspiration now and then NorthenAl. The experience will come to you and the inspiration you'll get from the crew and other interests. You've already got a wealth of info to take in and present in your own fashion.

Nice little fridge vac there Plummet. I used to run one till I scored a rotary vane from someone who thought it was a defective compressor of sorts. I think this was my 3rd kitesurf board back in 2002: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3330/3541470987_deb9313774.jpg?v=0
Looking forward to the new board though Mrs. Plumbtree's gonna be miffed when she gets her mirror back!

I gave up trying to be great at it after blowing my knees and my ankle out. So I just get out and have fun. Summer is for surf and winter is for land and snow. I will tell you that it gets expensive having too much fun though! So I buy my kites and I build my vehicles! Getting a little excited since it's my first new buggy kites since 2000 I think.

Ditto on the carbon fork porn. My photos will come along with a build blog. Soon as the sun shines when I'm at home.

wooowaaahh....rexton started the job in another workshop, but i said, oi!...you should ave welded it on the bottom aye bro!...i told him that ..i know its better in tention.. but its gonna work for 90mile...the way i see it its gonna cause a stress riser right on the rear bend now and really needs a plate gusset or better still, a full triangulation of the frame like plummet says, but without using rebar or guster wont talk to me again
that kinda stuff i understand.....but i am a padawan yes....WITH A STICK WELDER.. HAHHAAAR

one major problem we do have is his stainless wheel bolt has welded itsself upon extraction to the hardend axle threads.....gonna heat it tomorow an hope for the best but its not looking good...im fully expecting the bolt hex to snap off, then were gonna have to drill and extract the stud before 90mile not a fun one...any hints on that job welcome!!

im happy with my buggy now, i oiled all my bearings the other day so now my wheels actualy go roung more than once jimmy youd better watch out plummet, ill just roll past you if were on a down winder even before i get my kite up!
and iv re beaded my tubeless barrows about 18times and i think iv got them as round as thoes tyres wil ever get, i think thoes kings tyres are better than the duros jimmy, they just feel better..

cant help but grin at the great mix of stuff were all trying, i think its awsome.

ahhh... your screwed re the siezed bolt. my pick is that its galled. stainless loves to gall. once its galled i think drilling it out will be your only option. your nut threads will also be screwed...
on the off chance its just siezed in there soak that puppy in crc of a day and then heat.

heheh i'm a virgin with a tig, mig or stick..... but i'll give you the best pharmicutical grade weld yourve ever seen with my works orbital welder.

crc cant hurt and its a bit of lube too but yeah im guessing its been over tightened and the two bits of stainless have bonded, thats why we use galv steel bolts in the rears, stronger and no binding up. Maybe we should all consider using galv steel front bolts too ? If you dont NEED to take it apart maybe leaving it in there till after the weekend is a good move ? Still if you get a flat out there you will be stuffed. I thought i had the same problem the other day but it was the axle rotating, I did up the other bolt again and , bingo it came right off. at the least im now considering anti seize compound, but that is messy and picks up sand and dust.

yes always use a thread lubricate on stainless threads it will help prevent galling. stainless to stainless is the worst. even boring old grease is better than nothing.

For a start be glad it is stainless, at least you can drill it out. If at first it doesn't let go try a little direct heat to the nut or threaded insert side from an LPG or OA flame. Twistng with the spanner as you heat it up. Usually does the trick.

If it still won't budge, saw or grind it off with ~5mm sticking out, and progressively drill it out till your left with little more than the threads. Make sure it's as centered as you can manage and take it slow. Cut a little slot in the 5mm sticking out and use a screwdriver to unscrew the remainder which should come out cleanly. Otherwise keep drilling and hope it's centred enough so you just have to pick out the remaining threads left from the bolt. Use a finishing tap to clean up the threads.

Alternatively just grind the weld on the axle till you can remove the nut or threaded insert and weld in a new one.

As suggested try to use a little copper grease or anti-seize grease and consider building future buggies with stub axles with smaller retaining bolts. Alternatively use different stainless grades ie. 304 nut with a 318 bolt as they're less likely to gall that way.

The galv bolts is not a bad idea as the zinc in the galvanised layer is a softer metal between the harder parent metals and acts as an anti-gall or anti-seize. If they do break off you would have a pain drilling out the remaining grade 8 stub through... not impossible just a royal pain in the rear.

i think jimmy your onto the best idea, leave the bugger on till after 90mile
will see what rex wants to do,its his axle bolt...

guster thanks for materials. your a very good man...the only thing i really want to build asap is gannets ski axle for more comfortable moosing...so need to fabticate the mounting from plate and the pin holes from bar, but its a fair job and dont expect anything for nothing so maby we could nut out a price for that in the near future?
ill draw you a plan.
hows yours going gannet, did you fix the judder?

I had to put in some 12mm plastic spacers , were it's bolted together at the side rails and stub end plates at the wheel bolts.
and that did the trick

Sweet as N-Al. Just let me know a bit in advance. My supply is not open every Saturday but I tend to horde a little so may already have what you need.

I've laminated the fijian kauri ply for my springboard axle. Just waiting for the weekend to laminate the rest up. I have both 15mm(bigfoot classics) and 25mm(race) stubs ready for making wheel mounts and cannot make up my mind which is first!

Judder?

judder or chatter happens when the skis are broadside, the 12mm washers have now solved 90% of that.

judder....when you see realy ugly people in lycra.

I tend to shudder... but who am I to judge what sets you a-judder!

I'll have to keep my eyes on this juddering when I test my design.

is not the official term "axle tramp"?

juster. fijian kauri!..... weres the full carbon axle?
ps i've made 6 longboard skateboards from fijian kauri!

Tramps make me shudder too but I catch your drift there Plummet. The skis have very little torsional stiffness due to their narrow width and their flex is tapered to the tips for terrain response so in all I may have already covered this off in my design as my springboard axle is 8" wide in the middle and flex is uniform.

Yup, good old fijian kauri. However not the fancy 5 or 7 veneer ply stuff you'd prefer to use for a longboard. Just the cheapest strongest quality ply they had at Plyman.

I think I explained this somewhere before but here goes again. The design for this axle is to dampen. Simply has to hold my weight and absorb wheel vibration. Carbon in most guises would be to reactive and introduce rebound which in this case would be what I'm trying to avoid in the first place.

yes plummet, your right, its axle tramp...and its no good for my class 8 land yatch wotwot...

anyone ever heard of this? its for making fixed bridal foils depowerable, like blades, my 6.6 to be precice..
their are a few threads out there of fellas using them to great effect, wonderd if you guys had heard of it?

www.racekites.com/reviews/getReview.asp?reviewID=335

There is actually some published info on doing that yourself. I have a feeling it's a variation on the AAA adjusters on the flexifoils:
www.flexifoil.com/downloads/instruction_...v_tripleA_ammend.pdf

Where the C line bridle is left floating. Ie. A's are attached to the main lines and connected to the centre line on the bar, B's ride on a pulley and a bridle connecting A and C. The C's are then on the back lines to their respective sides on the bar. Brakelines are adjusted and bridled to the C's or left flapping.

Alternatively it may require a few more pulleys like a 'mixer' setup.
ie. panshforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1253

It might also be dependant on the version of your Blade too. If I recal the first generation were not pitch stable enough and would luff or stall with little sheet adjustment on the bar.

Sure you'll find it with a little googling or searching through community.flexifoil.com/

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I had a quick look round the inter web and found these two outfits

Pegasus Kites

Paraflysurf

It's an interesting idea,How hard do you reckon it would be to come up with a home brew version?

im not sure, i think its gotta be worth a go tho...this picture is what im talking about...a mixer
imagine biing in cotrol of a 6.6m blade 3
the blade3 i have is easy as the Az Bz and Cz are all seperate and i already have an AoA adjuster fitted to it, it make a huge difference, but you gotta land it to change anything.







but it looks like the hard part is getting the bridal tuned again

well i got the pulleys and line today...so im going to give it a go, im going to use a bar to start with, then when i get the feel of it then im going to try an use handles again.
thanks for the info their guster and feral.
feral let me know if you give it a go, im going to start on monday with whats their on the internet and just use cheap line untill i get the system all nice and compact then will publish it here..im quite exited, should make the kite good for snowkiting..
and very intrested to see how it handles in the buggy.

lovley blog spot their guster, love it....how long did it take you to get online?

Sweet. I may have some kites that could do with a mod like that. Will keep an eye on your efforts.

Registered a blogspot two weeks ago but haven't had time in the sun for photos so I started posting up some history for filler this morning till I get time for photos. Saturday looks like a good'un.

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cool northernAl, I like your line of thinking, I would like to add
is, when I was paragliding my glider had a speed bar (depower/ power-up)+ trim adjuster ( AAA )
I would have to look at the set-up again to see how it worked( was 9years ago)
I think it pulls down the B and C line to flatten out the glider.

and I would be keen on moding the B4s to a depower system

so axle photo's from
Gannet buggy productions

well here is the first attempts, they are both the wing warp system rather than a straight aoa adjuster....the straight aoa adjuster seems pretty easy, good news.
going to run aoa adjust on the pansh and wingwarp on the blade

so A line is fixed and the B moves half as far as C wich moves half as far as the brake
this is going to be a work in progress as everything is floating and subject to line loadings from the "next" pully , its almost impossible to imagine whats really gonna happen

so this is the best picture, the Aline is far right, and the brake far left.