Good afternoon all,

Following Jim's post in early December, we have had huge number of complaints against kiteboarders since then from swimmers, wind surfers, beach goers and residents from Takapuna, Cheltenham, Saint Heliers and Orewa. We have attended these complaints from the land and occasionally the water and have spoken to numerous people regarding the speed and distance in which they are operating thier kites to persons in the water.

These actions have made the local papers and has a large public interest at the moment and with this office currently undertaking a review of the Auckland Regional Navigation and Safety Bylaw (the local legislation that governs water users and activities), these people may make submissions to have this activity removed or limited by making reserved area's in these location's for swimmers only.

Whilst underway and exceeding 5knots you must stay at a distance of greater than 50m from any persons in the water and any vessel.

It currently is a minority that is damaging the sport for the majority and if this continues public pressure may see this sport pushed to less populated area's. As I kiteboarder myself I would far rather see that the sport self regulates, than allowing a beurocratic process to tell you that you can't board here because of a selfish few.

If you wish to discuss or moot any idea's please feel free to contact me.

Jae Staite
Maritime Officer
Harbourmaster's Office
Auckland regional Council

c/- Marine Rescue Centre
3 Solent Street
Private Bag 92 012
Auckland
Phone: +64-9-362 0402
Fax: +64-9-362 0399
Mobile: 021 792982[/img]

Hey Jae,

I'm in Orewa regularly and I'm happy to respect the rules and stay away from the flagged area. It happens pretty often, though, that swimmers enter the water close to the river mouth or right in the middle of the kiter zone. It's pretty much impossible to stay 50m clear of them.

Any advice on how to deal with that ?

50 meters is a long way to stae awae

z00m1n.... the problem starts with your comment 'the kiter zone' ..... there is no kiter zone... anyone has the right to walk into the water anywhere on that beach!.... and most will not appreciate the danger a kite can pose to their health.... regardless of where a swimmer enters the water the law says you keep 50m away... if you can't control your kite to do that.... then find another beach
problem solved

I think a few newer kiters I see think it is acceptable to ride near paddlers/ swimmers. Give them some consideration - get off your board, walk past them - well away from them , say a friendly hello - it goes a long way, then get on your way again. Make sure it is clear to them that you are in full control of the kite (if you are not you should really find an empty beach to ride at for now.)

This part of nz is so lucky to have so many spots to ride - I guess these complaints have been due to the rare times that light wind and good sun bathing days come together - luckily there are not too many of these here usually.

Orewa is very lucky in some respects for not mixing kiters and swimmers as swimming near the estuary is dangerous (especially in an outgoing current) - The surf club does a great job of making sure that those that swim there know that and they usually move to swimming between the flags. I spoke to 2 swimmers last week that looked at risk of drifting out in the estuary - I was not surprised to learn that they had just arrived in NZ from Germany. You are much less likely to understand about rips and currents coming from Germany than most kiwis that simply knows it is not safe to swim there and also not to swim directly against the current if washed out.

I have pulled in a swimmer that got washed out at least 500m by the Orewa estuary current - they were shouting at me for help - really far out - so I pulled them in with the help of my kite.

Hi Jae,

Its good to have someone interested in preserving the sport working in your position. And its becoming abundantly clear that self-regulation is the only way thats going to happen.

To that end, I put up a thread yesterday to talk about what I saw as a prime example of whats going to get us banned. It was entitled Another idiot at Eastern Beach. You might want to have a read.

Maybe I was over-reacting. And if someone, by way of a reasonable dialogue can convince me that I was, I'm willing to cop that on the chin. But if the guys kite came close enough to my head while I was standing on the beach to freak me out, I can only imagine that anyone who was a non-kiter and the beach wasnt exactly deserted - must have, er, soiled themselves.

Unfortunately, (going by the tone of their responses) the only respondents were two bong-head Wheres-My-Car-Dude merchants who couldnt string three words together giving me a hard time for it and one other guy whose only comment was hmmmmmm.

Not entirely helpful, for a high-growth sport facing a fairly dire situation that, short of a PR miracle, is going to come to a head very soon. And when it does, none of us are going to benefit.

Cheers.

I am that "Jim" that sparked this up as I think its better to try and see what is ahead and solve it before it happens than let the news papers rip us apart later.

It is simple really , make a designated area for kiting At orewa, Taka, Shoal bay... etc So peoples expectations are altered. At the moment everyone wants everything to themselves lets try a compromise.

Its a good start to have signs up warning kitesurfers to stay clear of people, now how about one warning the people and giving them a clear idea of the dangers of entering a kiting area that is already cranking, how about getting life guards to activly help, I belive Orewa life guards missed some events a while back because of a poor result at their beaches ?

maybe some one can clear that up for me, nicely...

Make a zone so we have a home.

I don't agree with that idea. Like I said orewa already has the fact that the area we kite in is dangerous to swim in.

The beaches with the problems are the urban ones and it is happening only on those days of light wind, sun , and holidays - which are so rare in NZ. I don't see why kiteboarders should be given an area of one of these beaches with free reign - I think that would make things even worse. That is like admitting you may go out of control at any time and you better watch out if you are walking your dog or going for a paddle.. - i know you don't totally mean it like this but knowing people this will be what the irresponsible think. My designated area is the high wind that makes no one want to go to the beach..

It is the minority that don't give respect back to those non kiters around them. I don't understand why there are people trying to ride at the busiest beaches - this is nz....... its not like you cannot find a beach to yourself if you are prepared to put in the effort and drive.

Nowdays learners and some kiteschools/lessons seem to go to the busiest spot possible, bang in the middle of the sweetspot for competent riders. Is anyone still teaching to keep the kite low if downwind?

I personally want to promote self responsibility with kiteboarding. It is an individuals sport and they should take individual responsibility for their actions.

I gotta add that the overall self responsibility /respect given by kiteboarders in nz, and even the level of competent riding is far ahead of any other country I have ridden in.

The lifeguards at orewa are cool and help out the kiters getting swimmer out of the water towards the estuary. To go too near or past the flags is kind of throwing back the good work they do in their face.

i do see what you mean, but I dont think the public has a very good understanding of kites and needs a bit of education and in 10 years i can see even Orewa looking like long bay or takapuna. I want to reserve our spot now.
I honestly think it is impossible to control every idiot out there, maybe the one that kills some one hasnt even begun to board yet? Maybe they recently moved to manly beach in Aus and just screwed it up for them so far? Maybe they went to England and got all their 50 odd beach bans put in place.

Its just a matter of time before it happens here , maybe a 100 years away maybe next week, if some one is hurt or killed and the swimmer was in a designated kite area then there is no blame to kiters, if its in no mans land then watch our world come tumbling down from people who know nothing of us and dont care about losing 2000 votes out of 1.5 million.
I want to have some where to go where no one questions it, at the moment all we have is tolerance. Tolerance will only last for so long, and our voice will be very weak after an incident. I am suggesting we make a proactive move beforehand and I appreciate it will take all of us to be considerate also.

i'm all for individual responsiblity, not just for kiters but for ALL beach users, the beach is for everyone - swimmers kiters surfers other small water craft etc etc etc

As for designated areas, or loosely designated, yep maybe at busy beachs its a good thing BUT....

Takapuna Beach is the most classic example of stupidity, over summer they provide temporary surf lifesaving towers and flags.... SO they put the flags right next to the yacht club, host to 3 different world champion series, windsurfers and small yachts all over the beach launching... not to mention the flags are about 100m from the boat ramp...DOH!!!! and this is SURF LIFE SAVERS policers of beach safety and saving lives, clearly they needed to add a challenge for themselves at Takapuna!!! there's a whole beach, why wouldn't you put the flags further away from the other users!?!?!!?

Maybe, if the swimmer somehow managed to throw themselves in front of the kiter, but the 50m navigation rule will still apply in a designated "kite area". What we need is to lead by example and self regulate (after all, we're the 'experts'), and if another kiter is acting 'carelessly' at our local kite area, then we need to let them know in the nicest possible way. A friendly chat can raise awareness.

Sounds typical, the idiotic few potentally spoiling it for the masses. Still its all about consideration, respect for other water users and learning the local rules by asking other kiters.
We are fortunate in Wellington to be allowed to kite (half of) Lyall Bay but even with less kiters than in AK there are some who venture or try to show off to close to the flags.
I hope we don't get banned a well as it is one ofthe primo spots in a southerly.

The other problem with a designated part of a beach is that by definition it will mean that is the only part we can go. Imagine the number of kiters somewhere like Cheltenham attracts, with the requisite half-dozen beginners' kites in the water instead of the sky at any one time, all crammed into half or less of the beach. It would be a circus. With the kind of growth the sport is seeing, imagine what it would be like in five years.

If someone's actions are creating a high risk of causing any physical damage to someone else then they should stop what they are doing. This may not be the best example but here goes:

When I'm driving a car it's up to me not speed or be reckless and put other people in danger. Bad drivers don't get special roads or areas just for them.

In the case of kiting the wind can be unpredictable and therefore to play on the side of caution, if nothing else caring for other people's safety is just sensible. We cannot expect the public to be knowledgable on our sport.

If my actions are putting someone else at risk then the responsible thing is to accept the feedback and adjust my behaviour.

if you are a bad driver and are caught you lose your licence and can be thrown in jail so that is not really self regulated.

I think the best definition of self regulation for us is that if you see someone else being a dick you tell them to sort it out or #$%^ off, and hopefully 10 other people do the same. we need to self police.

next week there are going to be a bunch of folks at the harbourmasters meetings who will be hoping to shut down thier beaches from kite surfers, if they are unopposed then it is very likely they will get thier wish, if not and kite surfers offer some credable alternative in a professional manor the beach will be still available. Have you ever seen a ban put in place and then lifted again ? our ranks are full of smart people that can argue our point, but will it happen ?

unfortunitly it's not just the close calls that will get kite surfing and other traction kite sports banned its the perceived danger you are to the swimmers, dog walkers, beach users, etc... its the it could happen factor!!!! This is why there are 50 bans in the uk not from incidents themselves but from the it could happen. and some of these bans are because the kite scare the wildlife not the people.

The fact is that most people perceive the beach to be a safe environment and don't take the precautions or the awearness to keep themselves safe i.e. going for a swim right where there are 5 kitesufers carving up the surf. This comes down to education for the beach users as most beach uses only swim in the water once or twice a year and you would think they would be a bit moree cautious but they aren't and no amount of public meetings will change that. So it is up to the kite users to think of the possible dangers who use the beach all the time to be awear of the danger they pose to the general public.

The only way to prevent bans is to do everything reasonably practical to safe guard the public and ourselves from danger. Yes designated area would help but don't be surprised if they are faraway with limited access and to small. Even if there are designated areas it doesn't reliquish our reasonability for the safety of others either kite users or the general public. Like what has already been mentioned be proactive meet with the councils turn up to public meetings promote the sport and apoligise if you have a close call with a member of the public that might be all it takes to avoid another complaint.

BE SAFE AND HAVE FUN!!!!!!!

I used to kite in the UK at Camber Sands and that got banned pretty quickly which ruined kiting in the South East. People then started kiting in more dangerous spots that weren't good for bathing (due to rocks etc) and then kiters started getting injured. I'm sure ACC will be well pleased if that happens!

At Takapuna beach we were supposed to launch by verbal agreement with the harbourmaster where the boat club is, but they made that the swimming zone. I asked the lifeguard where we should launch and she had no idea. Why is this the case - if lifeguards don't know how are we supposed to know?

As someone mentioned, how about a kite launching zone during peak hours/months (ie Jan - mid Feb) or for some rough landmarks we should launch within (ie boat club, 100m either side)

Anyone got thoughts on enforcement rather than outright bans? Also compulsory third party insurance can be good - some clubs do that in the UK and work pro-actively with the local authorities to ensure goodwill.

Lets look at ways of keeping the sport going in a reasonable and fair way without harming anyone.

Hmmmm Lets not forget that the beauty of New Zealand is freedom/less bureaucratic bullshit, and the peoples general respect for one another - kiters/non kiters. Sure there have been complaints in this EL Nina Year (ie more light easterlies than past 6 years) - but that is about it as far as I know.

Summer madness if over, back to school time. Takapuna just is the not the place to go on one of those summer madness day.

hey floks, long time no smell,i havent been on this forum 4 ages and im not surprised to hear that were still trying to work this issue out, i would like to see kiters have there own area, why shouldnt we. id like to see some signs at these spots giving basic info to the public, maybe we need to bring our own and put them around the kite zone, it astounds me when i see mom dad and the kids walk on to the beach and straight into the zone with a bunch of kiters goin hard, its not easy to be cool with that, just like the dicky kiters who fly into the swim zone, dont do it.

Its going to happen one day, its unavoidable, someone, somewhere is going to have an accident and injure a member of the public.
Not sure what the answer is and it maybe taken out of our hands anyway, but will this apply only to Auckland sites or will it have a knock on effect to the rest of NZ like it has had in the UK.
I agree with a lot that has been said on here and I think that a lot can be done now, especially by the more experienced kiters, in the way of self policing our sport.
Take time to educate the newbies and if someone is doing something that is clearly going to give us a bad rep, its upto the more experienced guys to sort them out, and I dont mean go and give them a good hiding..
The writing maybe on the wall so lets delay it as long as possible

yea i agree with "johnienz"